conference calls. we obviously -- if we just got the fed to say we are not going to taper until we're done with this nonsense, then we go back up and that's why you have to start picking at things into the weakness. there's always a bull market somewhere, i'm jim cramer, i'll see you tomorrow! jim cramer. i will see you tomorrow. will the bombs start flying in just a few hours? the senior administration source tells nbc news that, quote, we are past the point of no return, and air strikes against syrian targets appear inevitable within days. but i don't understand why we're telegraphing every punch and leaving assad and his regime in place. we're about to speaking to former defense secretary donald rumsfeld, and find out what he thinks president obama should do. stocks rebound today, but the syrian news drove gold and oil higher. are you about to see big price

increasing at the pump? on this 50th anniversary of the "i have a dream" speech, we look at the economic achievements for blacks in america. all those stories an more coming up on "the kudlow report" beginning right now. good evening, everyone. this is "the kudlow report." in a rapidly developing story, u.s. officials telling nbc news tonight that the syria crisis is, quote, past the point of no return. and that air strikes are expected soon to punish the syrian regime. nbc's richard engel joins us from the turkey/syria border with the latest details. good evening, richard. >> reporter: larry, the longer this goes on, the more difficult it is for the united states to carry out any action, let alone a decisive action. the u.n. inspectors were back at

their work, visiting sites where the worst of these alleged chemical attacks took place. they took hair, urine, blood samples. they want to continue their work. the man dade for these u.n. inspectors to be on the ground is supposed to expire on sunday s. but now the syrian government is asking them to stay longer. it's unclear if the u.n. inspectors are going to stay beyond that, but clearly syria wants them on the ground, wants them to continue their work to push off any kind of strike for as long as possible. also, syria continues to insist that it did nothing wrong. just today another syrian official said the terrorists, that's how syria describes the rebels, were responsible for these chemical attacks, and that syrian soldiers are now being treated in hospitals because of the result of poison gas. the u.n. hasn't come up with any conclusions, but one u.n. envoy said today that initial indications are that chemical

weapons were -- or a chemical material was in fact used, but he wouldn't say who did it. larry? >> all right, as always, many things to richard engel. let's head back to the washington for the very latest military plans. for that we're joined by "wall street journal" national security reporter dion nissbaum. i don't know if you heard richard engel's reports, now all of a sudden the syrian officials want the u.n. inspectors to stay forever. how should we all interpret this? >> i think that the administration has to factor in what happens with the u.n. inspectors. the administration is ready to go. the pentagon has the war ships in place with cruise missiles, which is expected to be the ships used for the limited strikes that they're talking about now, but they are going to be looking at how long the inspectors are going to stay there. they're supposed to say through

sunday, as you said. president obama is supposed to go off to the g-20 summit on tuesday in russia. russia is obviously a key playe. tomorrow we could see some intelligence from the administration that lays out part of the case. so i think it will still be a few days before we see any strikes. >> is there any doubt in your mind or the minds of the pentagon experts who do such things that this was assad's gang that launched the chemical weapons rather than, let's say al qaeda from iraq or some such jihadist group. is there any doubt about the source of this? >> well, i would say within the administration, there really is no doubt. they have said for a long time that the rebels don't have the capability to launch this kind of strike. the administration has said that the assad regime has carried out attacks like this before, you know, there's a lot of intelligence -- you saw a shift over the weekend with the

administration when they got new intelligence that showed that the syrian regime seemed to be covering up what happened in these neighborhoods, so they're pretty convinced this was the regime and they're the ones that really had the capability to do so. >> does the pentagon expect any resistance from the syrian air force? >> well, the value of using cruise missiles is they're able to fire the missiles from outside the range of the syrian air defenses, so that's not going to pose a problem. in terms of the limited strikes they're doing, it would just be cruise missiles. they're not talking about putting planes in the air at this point. so at this point the pentagon is not worried about it. >> you don't think that would be a surprise? no surprise there? >> the pentagon is not expecting any surprises in that regard from what i've heard. >> last one, in this waiting game, if we wait for the inspectors, to go through -- now perhaps through the weekend is what you're reporting is a possibility, do you think the president will or should -- i won't ask should -- do you think

he will ask congress for some kind of sign-off on this action? >> well, you know, they were definitely cass from the congressional leaders for the president to make his case and explain the purpose, the value here. he's talking about limited strikes that's meant to be punishing, to just deter him from using chemical weapons. and a lot of people are asking what strategic value is there? where do you go beyond that? >> i don't think the president will ask them for approval, but i certainly would expect the administration to make its kay to congress. thank you very much, dion nissenbaum. we're honored to be joined by defend, the author of the new book "rumsfeld's rules." welcome back as always.

i appreciate you coming on. i want to ask you this, why is the united states's authorities telegraphs all our punching. "wall street journal" called it loose lips. how long will they be there? how many strikes do we have? why will we not have regime change? why we're not going to slaughter the syrian army? what is the point of all that, mr. secretary? >> well, there certainly is no point from a military or strategic standpoint. the only advantage that accrues to anyone, i suppose, is to the obama administration, because they're trying to explain the things they're not going to do. of course, the disadvantage to our country is to the men and women in uniform. the last thing you want to do is to demystify it for your enemy. if you plan to do something, you're going to put men and women at risk. we all have to wish them

godspeed if that's what the president decides to do, but the administration certainly ought to not tell in advance what it is they intend to do. >> i mean, that's the way i see it, sir. i'm glad that's the way you see it. to me, demystifying, as you put it, how can anything good -- how can the chemical warfare threat end if assad is still in place? and if his army is still in pla is? i don't understand that. with that regime change, what changes? that's what i don't get. >> well, i think what's lacking in all of this is the administration has simply not indicated what the mission will be, what the goal, what the outcome, what is our strategic interests? until you do that, you can't explain to congress what your goal is. until you do that, you can't fashion a coalition of other

countries to be supported. they are tolee totally against doing anything, not withstanding the fact that the government at least -- i don't personally know what the syrian government has done by the way of use of chemical weapons, but our government sounds like they're very convinced they have used them. and russia and china have said that's fine. that seems to me that positions them in a pro-chemical weapon position, which is unfortunate. >> let me go into rumsfeld's rules. you always talk about, let's see, known/unknowns, you even talk about unknown knowns. i've borrowed it for many a column, and i thank you for that. let me just throw out what i think are known unknowns. feel free to correct me. you just mentioned russia and

china. i'm particularly -- what do we think we're going to do? how worried should we be about a russian reaction? >> i think what -- russia, of course, and china are both important countries in the world, and they have capabilities, and they have reals that are notably different than ours. if they decide that they want to come out on the side of the use of chemical weapons being an acceptable thing, then we can see that signal can go out to their friends and allies with respect to weapons of mass destruction, whether chemical, biological or nuclear. and of course they're the countries that are prop up -- they're the countries that are prop up -- if you think about it, in the middle east, the single most important thing is iran and its potential nuclear capability. the united states, with respect to syria, and indeed with respect to everything else we're

doing in the region, we have to have in mind what will be the implications in iran. will they conclude from our behavior that it's okay to proceed with their nuclear program? would they conclude that it's okay to use nuclear weapons? >> that preempts my other -- i i think it's a known unknown. i was going to ask you about iran, but now i want to ask you about israel. what's the known unknown with israel? >> israel, picture yourself -- i think it's useful to put yourself in the other fella's shoes. put yourself in the shoes of any leader. they have a very small country with a very small population. jews around the world have suffered the holocaust and been killed by the millions, and the regime in iran has said that israel has no right to exist, it should be shoved in the sea, should be eradicated, should be incinerated. they indicate repeatedly that it

has no right to exist, and they are pursuing nuclear weapons. i don't see how any leader in israel can do anything other than take action to protect the israeli people. we're going to leave it there. many thanks, former secretary donald rumsfeld. known unknowns, and unknown unknowns. i'm still working on that. thank you, mr. rumsfeld. now, folks, the oil and gold market are locked in. many are asking will it mean a spike in gasoline prices? we're going to get some answers, next up. later the i.r.s. policy of singling out tea party groups seems to have totally backfired. tea party leaders say the scandal has rejuvenated their movement. we are going to talk to one tea party leader about that story. don't forget, folks, fry market capitalism is the best path to prosperity. that happens to be the backbone of the thinking of the tea party.

i'm kudlow. we'll be right back. alert.

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with national gasoline prices averaging arch $3.50,

should you fill it now before oil prices climb even higher? here now is cnbc contributor addison armstrong. and patrick dahan, senior petroleum analyst at gasbuddy.com. addison, you first. how do you see this story? will it be quick and other fast. >> there are two scenarios, larry, if there is no military strike, of course, then prices should come off very quickly. we were up about 10% in five days. prices were actually trending lower before the alleged syrian gas attack. you know, i think should we go in militarily if it's over clean and quickly? we'll probably see a knee-jerk reaction. i would expect wti to trade into

the 120s. if the conflict were to spread throughout the region and become much wider, all bets are off, and we're talking about prices that would be at least as high as back in 2008. >> patrick, would you comment on addison's point that you have a risk here that i think addison implied, brent crude up to 140, and west texas up to 120, if and when the missiles start flowing. i assume the action will take three or four days. i'm not smart enough to know. patrick, would you agree with addison? so.i think i don't know that the spread between brent and west texas would be so significant. it certainly could be, but for the average motorist, i don't as bad as will be what we saw in libya.

bars some catastrophe -- >> yes, i think it's a bit better than we thought it would be earlier this year. refining activities slow down, because they're getting ready for them to produce heating oil. so if this becomes a nonevent, it won't be an event for u.s. drivers, either. let's put syria aside, we'll have a thought experiment. why is west texas crude above

$100 a barrel. united states is producing more oil. than we have in i don't know how many decades. saudi arabia and the other side, they're producing almost 10 million barrels a day, as far as i know. why are the oil markets this tight, given the fact that the world economy is lousy? >> well, the situation you present, why is west texas closing on brent or why is the gap narrowing? i think pipelines have started to reverse the flow. there's not quite the bottleneck that used to exist, and inventories are declining, and that's keeping pressure on prices upward now to close the gap with brent. >> and you're saying, as long as the pipelines are reversed, that that price is going to stay high? >> well, i think that as long as the pipe did not lines are reversed, it's not going to lead to the price depression that you

saw in west texas, thanks to the inventory surge that had existed. now the inventories are flowing ouch curbing, and you're seeing prices go back up instead of be almost artificially depressed. just like canadian oil has seen prices blossom, because all of a sudden the talk in railcars, you can't find a railcar to ship canadian oil out. they're all really taking, so it's all with pipeline fundamentals. you have ka knead jane oil, and west texas flowing out of curbing, and it's evening out the differentials. >> we covered this story about the pipelines and the trucks and freight and rest of it, but there's something like $40 billion -- all right, i think i'm close -- $40 billion of expected investment in pipeline. that's a lot of money. doesn't the matter begin to see

through that? the futures market begin to see through that, and delivery will be safer and faster of crude, and that that's going to help the gasoline refiners? >> yeah, larry undoubtedly eventually that new capacity that's planned, most of it will come to fruition, and certainly the scenario that patrick is paints of increasedability to move oil from where it's produced and stored, to places where it can actually be usefully run through a refinery, that's all very well and good. but at the same time, you know, oil prices are not going to come down, as long as, you know we've got these kind of tensions in the middle east. it's not just syria. libya, you have to remember, their output has fallen to only about 200,000 barrels a day, whereas they were on track to be where they were before the revolution. that's quite a sudden turnaround, but iraq has

increased its production, assuming the pipeline that goes from iraq through turkey, iraq is producing as much oil as thif in i don't know how many years. >> that's true but, you know, with the world prices of oil, the brent and wti benchmarks reacting to all this tension in the middle east. iran and the nuclear program in the background. there's a risk premium that's been built into the price. that's got to come out for prices that eventually come back down and they were trending down before the syrian gas attack. we'll leave it there. addison and patrick, thank you very much. middle hassan has learned his sentence. cnbc's josh lipton has that story and more for us, next up.

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seems like jpmorgan is a pinata, and federal regulators are the kids with the sticks. everyone gets a whack. josh lipton joins us with that story and more. good evening. >> good evening, larry. you have a point. listen to this. the office of the controller of the currency in the consumer financial protection bureau going after jpmorgan over the way it sold credit cards. fines to that could be $80 million according to numbs

number of time -- "new york times." we reported yesterday about a penalty that they want -- to pay over mortgage-backed securities. there's also the outstanding case of the so-called london whale. in a settlement with the s.e.c., in a similar agency in the uk. and the ft. hood shooter sentenced to death, convicted of 13 murders during the 2009 shooting rampage, attorneys advising him, thinking he wanted to get the death penalty. he didn't say a word in his own defense during the sentencing phase. all day cnbc has been going global looking at the economics around the world, their impact on the u.s. and vice versa. here is "u.s. news & world report" on china. >> here in china, people feel this country would be relatively immune if the u.s. federal reserve scaled back the easy money policies. china has capital control, so the money that would be flowing out of the emerging markets to

the united states would mainly be coming from otheration nations. that doesn't mean that china is totally out of the woods. analysts say the outflow could hurt the economies here, for cnbc business news, i'm in china. many thanks to eunice, and josh limit ton. . today marketed the 50th an verse of the "i have a dream" speech. we're about to look where afric african-americans have indeed great economic strides and find out why there is such a gap between blacks and whit it can it comes to income, employment and top corporate positions. that's next up on "the kudlow report." when we made our commitment to the gulf, bp had two big goals:

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i have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character. i have a dream today. there have been examples of success within black america that would have been unimaginable a half century ago.

as already been noted, black unemployment has remained almost twice as high as white employment. latino unemployment is close behind. the gap in wealth between races has not lessened. it's grown. >> that was dr. martin luther king and then president barack obama speaking 50 years apart about racial inequality in this country. so just how much progress have we made? we're looking at this through a financial, economic and business lens, and then the question is how much more do we still need to do? here now is larry elder 790 kabc radio host. robert traynham, and joining us by phone, robert johnson, founder and chairman of the rlj companies. larry elder, let me begin with you on this. i think it's interesting. there are more african-american ceos today than ever before. i daresay there are more in

business, in corporations than ever before, or maybe owning their own business. i came across a stat, there are more black elected officials by a huge amount over the past century. we never would have guessed. and yet as president obama said, let's just take unemployment. the unemployment rate is twice as much. why is that? why are there successes and why can't we solve these other challenges? >> well, the unemployment race is twice what it is -- but it has very little to do -- in fact, back in the 30s bhf we passed minimum wage laws, a black teenager was more likely to have a job than a white teenager, but we've done a lot of dumb things. we passed things like minimum wage law, incentivized men, and incentivized women into marrying into the government. and back in '65, 25% of black

kids were born out wedlock. now it's 75%. clearly with a black president and reelected, the country is less racist than in 1965. >> let me go to my friend robert johnson, who is on the phone. this is from the economic policy institute, over the last 50 years, the black unemployment has been consistently twice as high as the white. black unemployment has averaged 11.6%. today it is 12.6% after presumably the fifth year of a recovery. in your judgment, bob johnson, why is that? >> well, first of all, i totally disagree with larry's assumptions that there is a -- the responsibility lies with the rank-and-file black american. sure there are problems that african-americans face as much as white americans and hispanic

americans, and other ethnic groups. however, this is a capitalist society, a free market economy, and if you do not have access to capital, no matter what kind of work ethic you have, no matter what kind of innovative approach you have to business opportunities, you cannot succeed in this nation, so race discrimination has been the cornerstone of denying african-americans access to the essentially tools that have created the wealth in this nation, and it starts with access to capital, access to opportunity. you change that equation, you create more capital flow into the hands of minority business men and women, you will see a change in unemployment, because african-americans tend to hire more when they create jobs. you'll see a change in closing the wealth gap, as they become an ownership society 'opposed to

an employment society. you will see a change in family dynamics as families are able to take care of themselves because they're able to build wealth and pass that wealth on to future generations. >> let's go to bob traynham. i want you to comment. you've heard two different points of view. where do you had come out? >> i come down the middle. i think they're both right, but one thing we haven't talked about is access to a good quality education. we also know that individuals that have a higher education, meaning an advanced college degree or something of that sort, whether it's a certificate or something like that, they're more eligible or there's more opportunities for them to build their wealth. what does that mean? that means obviously getting a first home. african-americans historically their homeowner is lower than their white counterparts.

and so although it is access to capital and although it is about ownership and frankly some accountability within the african-american community, it's also about access to good quality education. and that's why historically good quality colleges have been a cornerstone for creating that black middle class. there's still a long way to go. >> larry elder, look, there's probably a lot of truths here on both sides. pew does these surveys, and so do others. here are the factors they come out with to try to explain. number one is your point, marital status, but they also talk about incarceration, they talk about education, and larry, they also mention residential racist segregation. that is, if you live in a

segregated neighborhood, the likelihood is you're not going to get out of that neighborhood. that's a thought that i hadn't really thought much about until i read this survey. what's your take, larry elder? >> those terr symptoms. between 1890 and 1940, take a look at the census, a black kid was slightly more likely to be born in a family with a nuclear intact mom and dad. what's 457d is there's clearly more racist 1890 to 1940. furthermore a black college educated couple where both sides work, they outearn a white educated couple. regarding education, then all of us ought to be in favor of vouchers to allow inner city parents who want to put their kids into a much better school, not until like the d.c. hope scholarship programs that unfortunately president obama and the democrats are shutting down. >> bob, what's your take on that? i've heard this. >>

my area -- this is not complicated. education is available to any african-american who wants to pursue it. the opportunities to get an education and a degree is there. education does not guarantee you success, as much as access to capital guarantees you an opportunity. so to me, i would much rather fight for a change in the tax code to move the flow of capital in the hands of minority businessmen and women than i would worrying about pouring more money -- we have spent more money on educating african-americans over the centuries that we have been here than any time in this history, yet unemployment has remained for 50 years, blacks double that of whites. the wealth gap, you -- the west gap has increased from $20,000 some 25 years ago to $90,000

today. statistics show that african-american kids whose parents were solidly middle class in the '60s and '70s, some 60% will never attain the wealth of their parents. it's not for a lack of commitment to a work ethic. it's not because they've come from broken homes itches that's a really important points irnts it's not because they don't have college degrees. it's because they do not have access to capital to create opportunities to buy homes, to start businesses, to build wealth, to invest in the equities market, to grow their own internal economies in their own neighborhoods. this is a very simple problem. it's not complicated. >> larry, i think we're all saying the same thing. you need some type of knowledge to understand that you may have access to the capital. you also need a good quality education to be able to understand the system, but also thoroughly, and this is something i think larry mentioned a few years ago, you

need a strong nuclear family, which we know has the achilles' heel if the african-american community for confide some time in terms of black men not having a male figure in their wife, in terms of having many children out of wedlock. there's a lot of pillars we need to address. >> i got to leave it. thank you, gentlemen. i appreciate it. a lot of very important points. i only hope that we can pursue them and succeed, and even things out, and give african-americans every shot they can possibly good. larry elder, thank you. robert traynham. robert johnson, always good to hear from you. the stocks had a modest rebowen, but is syria the only things on traders' minds? that's next up on "the kudlow report." and this will be your premium right here.

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washington also to blame? here now is stephanie link of the street, and chief investment office and copuff portfolio manager of jim cramer's charity trust. >> i want a thought experiment. i want to take syria out of the cal inclusion right now. i just can't figure that out. nobody can. gold went up and oil went up before syria. what does that mean? >> i think gold is telling you that they were starting to sniff out some things politically. i think that the oil is very -- i can't understand it to be honest with you, if it's not syria, because the economic data points have been mixed at best, right? good initial claims, cycle lows, some good manufacturing data, good isms, terrible durable goods. >> not so good. >> a lot of lousy numbers. >> that's the problem. when you say that oil went up, has been going up, it's not

because of the economic data. i think it has to do they were sniffing out what's happening in the middle east. >> our earlier guests thought pipeline, reversing the pipeline, getting them to refineries. i don't know oil should be weaker. i'm going to get your stock picks in a second. the rise in gold, which i think had nothing to do with syria, either then or now, and it started several months ago, but maybe gold is telling you, the fed, is not going to end the purchase of bonds any time soon, because the economy is weaker than we think. in fact, maybe it's time to wait, buy bonds, because long-term interest rates are coming down some more. >> that was my point. commodities are mixed. i will say this, though, larry europe data has been better. china data has been better. japan -- the talk about

reflation, that's the ultimate reflation trade. >> is that why you like the cyclicals? >> yeah, so i think that second half of this year, maybe more 2014 story, the global economies actually do better. barring whatever happens in syria. but let's just say that the syria thing happens, and it doesn't, it's not too long. and oil doesn't stay at these levels. if oil stays at these levels, that's the last thing we need. i do think the glob martz are getting better. you've seen copper tick higher, seen ire ore tick higher, certainly not where they need to be. but better than where we were. >> how much does it matter that india is crashing, brazil -- i won't say crashing, but brazil has a lot of trouble with the economy. i agree that the china numbers are a little better, but there i would say stability, not really good growth. how is this for global profits,

for global american companies? >> very mixed. very mixed. so that's why i think those three -- the areas i mentioned -- europe, japan, china -- are the areas we are investing in in the global markets. we're not touching india. we have one exposure, one name exposed in brazil, but they're also a china play, so i think you have to be very, very selective. here back at home, we're growing at 2%. i think to your point on the fed, i think even if they don't something, even if it's tape erbil light, okay, fine, maybe it's just taper light, and they stay taper light. >> they have to stop killing each other. there's bloodshed on the floors of the halls of the fed. i've never seen anything like it. >> they just can't. the economy doesn't support it. >> you're going to stay with the defensive stocks? >> we have a lot of cyclicals,

and we've been -- because of what i'm saying, in terms of the global economies recovering. i do think eventually we can get ourselves out of this malaise, but i think sprinkle in some defensives. >> stephanie, thanks. the tea party didn't run away and cower. quite the opposite. we're about to talk to one tea party leader about how the movement has been reenergized by lois lerner and the rest of the crowd at the irs. next up, on kudlow. that's right for you, including the lexus es and ct hybrids. ♪ this is the pursuit of perfection.

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call it the tea party comeback. outrage over the irs targeting of conservative groups, spurring the revival of the grass-roads political movement behind the republican tidal wave in 2010. just how will this impact the upcoming 2014 midterm elections? here now we welcome jenny beth martin as cofounder of ceo of tea party patriots. all right. so the i.r.s. targeting 6 conservative groups have really revived the tea party movement. let me ask you, though, are you still at war with the i.r.s.? from what i gather they're still demys tax exemptions. >> not just that they're denying it, we got another intrusive letter from them just last week. it hasn't stopped at all. it concerns me, because i don't know if it's ever going to stop. >> all right. well, you're raising good money,

no question about it. there's a great chart in today's newspaper. let me ask you, what is your strategy? what are the key issues that you want to emphasize in the coming elections? >> well, we want to continue to stick to what we've done all along, when is a constitutionally limited government, ically responsible government. we want free markets to actually operate in america once again. that's what we're going to do. we're focused right now on the resolution and obama care. we'll continue to make those our two primary issues as we move into 2014. >> the creed of this show is free market capitalism, so i love that. you mentioned continuing resolution and obama care. let me ask you, if house members or senators vote in favor of a continues resolution to avoid a shutdown, for example, and ditto with defunding obama care, will

the tea party run people against them? >> you know, i think it's more important to say why would they be doing that in the first place? we want the entire governmenting to funded, except for obama care. we don't think that it's right that the president has given delays to big business, that he, through the office of personnel and management exempted members of congress and their staff from obama care. congress is exempt from this law, but we the taxpayers are having to pay for it. it's time for the members of konk to make sure they're not above the law, and that it's applied equally and fairly in this country. >> will you take a one-year delay? >> that's surgeally what this would do. it would pay for the government, everything else in it, except for obama care. this isn't going to repeal obama care. it just stops our taxpayer money on a law that even congressmen and senators and their staff are exempt from. >> how about the debt ceiling,

something that wall street worries about? if house members and senators vote in favor of increasing the debt ceiling, even if they cut spending at the same time, can you live with that? or is that a no-no? >> i would have to see what they're talking about, but we have consistently said the spending needs to stop. we don't need to keep borrowing and borrowing. at some point we're going to have to pay the price for all of the debt we are incurring. if they actually made real spending cuts, we've always said that we're in favor of a 1% spending cut across the board each year for five years. at that point you're headed or are at a balanced budget. we're not asking about one penny out of every dollar they spent to be cut. you have four prominent senators being primaried by tea party people. lindsey graham, mitch mcconnell, la mark alexander and mike enzi.

i don't know about wyoming, but we'll be that. what's the beef against mcconnell? >> look at right now what's happening with the continuing resolution and obama care. he has promised he would fight to repeal this law. there's the opportunity for him to fight to make the case to the american people that congress should not be above the law, and yet he's not fighting on it. the people in kentucky are very concerned about this, and they're not happy with it. people across the board for each of the senators that you name, if they voted against this law in 2009, and 2010. and then they turn around and fund it today, that's like being against it before they're for it. >> well, of course, you know a lot of people say, including myself, that the 2010 election in the house was basically a tea party election. the question i guess everybody wants to know is can 2014 be a tear party election, where you election a coalition of republicans and conservatives? don't you fred that if you go

after the lindsey grahams or the mitch mckonlt or lamar alexanders, you might lose your opportunity and hand the senate back over to the democrats? >> you know, our concern is we want to make sure that the congressmen and senators are doing the right things for all americans, regardless of whether the republican or the democrat, and we've said all along and in 2010. if people get elected and they don't do what they promise to do, then we will hold them accountable. it isn't about republican or democrat. these -- this law right now with obama care. we're at the point where it's republican and democrat, congressmen and senators against the rest of america. that's unacceptable. >> have you met with mitch mcconned? >> i met with mitch mcconnell at a press conference we did right after the i.r.s. scandal broke. >> and your conclusion? a good man? what do you think?

>> i don't think this this isn't about whether they're good or bad men, but doing what's right for our country. exempting yourself from a law, not holding yourself to the same standard you're going to make the rest of america be held that, that isn't good for america. i'm concerned with whether they're doing the right thing for our country. >> all right. i hear you. thanks very much. again jennie beth martin, we appreciate it. good luck to you. >> thank you. we'll see you tomorrow night. ry much. ry much. ok guys, i'm back. i need a template of a template. oh my gosh. i've never even seen this record, i've only read about it in books. yeah we can get some peanut...that is huge. please don't judge the amount of peanut butter we are getting. from prepaid to platinum, cashback and more membership has a card for every character. i'm carrie brownstein and i get to be whoever i want. this is what membership is. this is what membership does.

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>> narrator: in this episode of "american greed"... >> he had millions and millions and millions and millions and more millions. >> narrator: ...matt cox and rebecca hauck... >> matt says, "i got to get out of here. i got to leave," you know, "you want to come?" >> narrator: ...the bonnie and clyde of mortgage fraud. >> his plan was to get as much as he can and go somewhere else and do it and go somewhere else and do it. >> now, at that point, i really did, i thought, "they'll never catch me."